12 Aug 2010

After being asked yet again for a road frame with an Edge fork, I thought I’d put out the proverbial ‘I’m not happy, Jan’ to the guilty parties who make the life of small time custom bike builders (or maybe just ones from Australia) just that little bit more of a pain in the arse than it needs to be.

Back in late 2008, we were buying Edge components directly from Jake at Edge. He was very helpful and obviously keen to increase his business, and very keen to get Edge on our Tephra XCR test bike which featured in RIDE magazine.

Warwick,
How goes it? This is a great opportunity that we would like to jump on. What do we need to do in order to get a fork and wheels on this bike??

Before the XCR test, I was running a set of Edge 2.0 forks which they gave to me at their manufactured cost, which I thought was very generous.

Just when I thought I had negotiated some Edge wheels and forks for the test, I get handballed to this guy Peter Kyriakidis who was now apparently the new ‘Australian Distributor’.

Dear Warwick, thank you for your enquiry which Jake Pantone has forwarded to us as we are the Edge Composites Distributors in Australia and New Zealand and all sales are handled by us.

The price to you for the purchase of one Road 2.0 Fork is $615 ex GST and RRP is $981. We would need to know what rake you require before quoting a delivery time.

With regard to the wheelset, our standard builds use DT Swiss Aerolyte spokes and DT Swiss 240 or 190 hubs. The prices to you for one set of clinchers are $$3150 and $3,530 ex GST respectively with corresponding RRP’s of $5,050 and $5,650.

Warwick, please us know how we can assist you further.

I made it quite clear that I was not going to pay them a margin for showing their product on the bike, and that if they wanted the exposure, then I was not going to be the one to pay them for it - I wanted the products either free or at manufactured cost. The guy just couldn’t understand. On the phone he said to be “But Baum has to pay for their parts”, as if they were the beacon of fairness and righteousness.

“Let me make it simpler for you. Your logos are going to be plastered all over my bike, in a test paid for in lieu and negotiated over 6 months by me, and you want me to give YOU money for that exposure?”

Still nothing.

So as we were running out of time and I’d already promised the owner of the Tephra XCR Edge forks and I wasn’t going to pay 700 bucks for them, I had to give him my own set.

Of course literally within a month of the RIDE article going to print, I get a customer calling up saying “I want one just like that!”

Awesome.

So I send this Peter guy another email trying to figure out why he and vicariously Edge are trying to stooge me.

Hi Peter,
Does Edge now no longer have an OEM/Small order pricing structure?
I’ve already quoted my customer based on the previous pricing I have purchased forks for from Jake.
This bike we are currently doing for a customer is off the back of our recent very favourable review in RIDE Cycling Review of our new Tephra XCR, which featured your forks.
If I have to go back to my customer and reneg on my quote by such a huge amount, it’s not going to look good for any of us.
Can you see any possible solution?

Regards,
Warwick

Essentially I quoted the original prices I’d been given by Edge thinking they’d see the light, or at worst I’d have to get them grey market so I didn’t lose a whole pack of money for no good reason. Check the gumption of this guy.

We have quoted you the wholesale price which is the low volume price break. We would be happy to review this on the basis of a committed forward order plan over the year or for batch orders of more than 10 of each component.
Warwick, if I understand the sequence of your emails correctly, it seems you quoted prices to your customer and then enquired about the basis on which you could purchase the corresponding items. It is therefore remarkably inappropriate to imply that either Cycling Edge or Edge Composites can, or should, take any responsibility for you having done so.

At this stage, I was way past ‘Not happy, Jan’.

Hi Peter,
I really don’t understand your sales technique here.
Yes, your assumption about the ’sequence of emails’ is incorrect. I quoted my customer back in 2008 based on the 2008 “Industry Price List” prices I had, and now that the frame is ready to turn into a bike, I see here 3 months into 2009 I’m faced with a 125% price increase?
How does that exactly make me “remarkably inappropriate”?
Personally I’m finding your adversarial sales technique and gross overcharging just a bit more “remarkably inappropriate” than me trying to get a good deal for my customer.

My email was cordial and reasonable and based on the information I had, so it’s very disappointing to me to be affronted by such a reply, from someone who’s supposed to be a representation of the companies they import.

My only crime is not purchasing three months ago when I could have got the forks for a more reasonable USD185. I’ve supported Edge Composites in a very small way but a much as I can, but my custom and support appears to be frowned upon.

Is your level of courtesy based on volume of sales, or do you have some other yardstick?

Yeah, I got no reply from that one. I mean, the postie can’t deliver when the bridge has been burned down, right?

Essentially what Edge have done, I consider a particularly interesting morally and ethically questionable business practice. Peter Kyriakidis runs ‘Cycling Edge’ which is a retail outlet nee importer of Parlee, Moots et al.., so what they’re doing is deliberately pricing me out of the market in favour of some dude importer of other custom builders whom they do support. This is from the same company that says proudly on their website

In fact, we’ve been making….parts for the nation’s most fastidious frame builders…custom artisans who refuse to adopt the big box mentality. That said, their demands are higher….When you’re committed to the perfect marriage of art and engineering, you don’t settle for second best.

One thing you won’t find from Edge is a bunch of marketing hyperbola. Sure, we have a great PR and marketing department, but we’re 100% wholesome in our statements….You only have to look at who we partner with to develop our distribution to understand just how committed we are to checking every box that the entire team is worthy of representing. It’s all about walking it - and we’ve put plenty of miles in; as have our athletes.

What a bunch of crap. One rule for them, another rule for anybody else.

How easy would it have been to have sold me some parts at cost for the RIDE article, and allowed me to purchase Edge parts just like my US counterparts do, direct and at equitable prices, rather than handball me to some @$#%&@ with no long term brand building ideas short of ‘how much money will this sale make me?’.

Instead, I haven’t sold a single Edge part, and instead opted for Easton for our road builds (and now 3T).  It’s cost them sales and goodwill, all so some retailler can protect his over inflated bottom line.

Well if you’ve read this far you deserve a medal, but I hope it gives some insight of literally as a small business person what you have to deal with, month in, month out.

It’s the absolute height of irony of course, because it’s these companies that rely on small builders to give them the cachet when they’re start-ups, that are the same ones to reject them when the OEMS come calling.

Mmmm…..wholesome.

Posted by warwick @ 11:52 am

3 Responses to “The Edge of (Un)reason.”

1. anon Says:
   August 13th, 2010 at 6:37 am

   bwahaha
   And distributors wonder why riders in Australia buy stuff online.

   The Nicolai importer sells their product at a 100% mark up from European RRP.

2. Rob Says:
   August 28th, 2010 at 12:10 am

   In the very limited number of times I’ve had misfortune to talk with Peter Kyriakidis, I’ve always found him to be a complete and utter TOOL. Its a shame he is the distributor for some of the reasonable brands!

3. thylacine Says:
   August 28th, 2010 at 12:17 am

   Well, apparently according to a colleague theres going to be some form of shake-up with Edge distribution after Eurobike, but it’s not clear exactly what that’s going to be. I’m hoping it will be a more equitable deal for Australia custom frame companies.

Leave a Reply